Mary Scanlon MSP

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Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon (Highlands and Islands) (Con)

We are looking at the Audit Scotland report on accident and emergency services today. We could not ask Audit Scotland what was happening with the Scottish Ambulance Service and NHS 24, and why two out of three people presenting at accident and emergency self-refer, but I feel that we can ask you.

The overall increase in the number of patients over the past four years is 50,000. However, if we drill down slightly, we see that at Ninewells hospital the number is down by 46,000, while in Aberdeen it is up by nearly 63,000. The number for Edinburgh is up by 112,000 and for Glasgow it is up by 85,000.

What are you doing to find out why there is a huge increase in self-referral? My point is that we no longer have an accident and emergency service—we have a 24/7 open door to the NHS. Patients are—quite rightly—now saying, “This is where I choose to go”, perhaps because they are getting from one service what they are not getting elsewhere.

If that continues at the same rate, we will no longer have an accident and emergency service. It seems that GPs are doing less and less, and patients are voting with their feet to go to A and E. What are you doing about NHS 24, GP referral and the two thirds—66 per cent—of patients in A and E who are self-referring? Is the service really an accident and emergency service any more?



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

We have the data here in the report. At Ninewells hospital, 50 per cent of patients at A and E self-refer; at Aberdeen royal infirmary, the figure is 74 per cent. For other hospitals, such as Hairmyres, the figure is more than 80 per cent.

Why is it that 50 per cent of patients at Ninewells, which we welcome as a beacon of good practice, are self-referring, whereas at Aberdeen royal infirmary the figure is 75 per cent? I picked out Aberdeen just because its representatives appeared before the committee last week. The number of self-referring presentations at accident and emergency at Aberdeen royal infirmary is 25 per cent higher than at Ninewells. Why is that?



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

Is it exhibit 5 on page 14?



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

I do not know whether that is the one that you were referring to—



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

Exhibit 4—okay.



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

Okay—well, if you do not understand it, we are not going to get much further on that. I was hoping that we would have a more holistic picture from the health service. It would be wrong to ask Audit Scotland about the Ambulance Service and other areas when it looked only at A and E. The question of what is happening with GPs, NHS 24 and the Ambulance Service underlies the Audit Scotland report, which is why I am keen to understand all of that. Until we understand that, we will not know why two out of three patients self-refer. They are doing that for a reason, and we have to respect that reason.



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

It is all that we have.



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

The issue came up with Audit Scotland last week. It is difficult for us to do the job when we do not have accurate, comparable data. I can only work with what is in front of me. Audit Scotland said that the data are not comparable. I will leave it to the convener to pick up on that—I am only the deputy convener.



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

I have one more question to ask, when you are ready.



Public Audit Committee 08 October 2014 : Wednesday, October 08, 2014
Mary Scanlon

I had only two questions, the second of which concerned the point that was raised by the medical director from NHS Grampian about the NHS Scotland resource allocation committee figures and, previously, the Arbuthnott formula. I do not have the figures in front of me, but I remember them and they were accurate. Per capita, Ninewells hospital gets around £1,945 and Aberdeen royal infirmary gets £1,500. Therefore, every person in NHS Grampian is funded at nearly £500 less than a patient in Tayside.

Is Aberdeen being punished for being the oil capital? I remember Arbuthnott 1, Arbuthnott 2 and all that, but is the NRAC formula appropriate? Are we really funding Grampian appropriately to provide the service, given that we can easily criticise its performance?

Vote DetailMSP VoteResult

S4M-11123 Joe FitzPatrick on behalf of the Parliamentary Bureau: Business Motion—That the Parliament
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Not VotedCarried

S4M-11114.2 Kenny MacAskill: Policing—As an amendment to motion S4M-11114 in the name of Graeme Pear
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Not VotedCarried

S4M-11114 Graeme Pearson: Policing—That the Parliament acknowledges that policing in Scotland contin
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Not VotedCarried

S4M-11116.1.1 Patrick Harvie: Scotland’s Future—As an amendment to amendment S4M-11116.1 in the name
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Not VotedCarried

S4M-11116.1 Nicola Sturgeon: Scotland’s Future—As an amendment to motion S4M-11116 in the name of Jo
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Not VotedCarried

S4M-11116 Johann Lamont: Scotland’s Future—That the Parliament recognises the result of the independ
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Not VotedCarried

Amendment 61 moved by Elaine Murray on motion S4M-11101 Kenny MacAskill: Courts Reform (Scotland) Bi
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NoDefeated

Amendment 62 moved by Margaret Mitchell on motion S4M-11101 Kenny MacAskill: Courts Reform (Scotland
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YesDefeated

Amendment 63 moved by Margaret Mitchell on motion S4M-11101 Kenny MacAskill: Courts Reform (Scotland
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YesDefeated

Amendment 64 moved by Margaret Mitchell on motion S4M-11101 Kenny MacAskill: Courts Reform (Scotland
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YesDefeated

Search for other Motions lodged by Mary Scanlon
EventIdTypeSub TypeMSP NameParty NameConstituencyRegionTitleItemTextFormattedAnswer DateAnswerStatusIdExpectedAnswerDateAnsweredByMspApprovedDateSubmissionDateMeetingDateProductionStatusIdRecordStatusIdStatus DateOnBehalfOfConsideredForMembersBusinessCrossPartySupportRegisteredInterestSupportCountSupportDateIsEventLinkCurrentMinister
Motion S4M-11145: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 08/10/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-10829.2: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 19/08/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-10735: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 05/08/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-10716: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 04/08/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-10471: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 24/06/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-10395: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 19/06/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-10131.2: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 27/05/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-09376.1: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 18/03/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-09034: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 13/02/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Motion S4M-09033: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 13/02/2014 Show Full Motion >>
Search for other Questions asked by Mary Scanlon
EventIdTypeSub TypeMSP NameParty NameConstituencyRegionTitleItemTextFormattedAnswer DateAnswerStatusIdExpectedAnswerDateAnsweredByMspApprovedDateSubmissionDateMeetingDateProductionStatusIdRecordStatusIdStatus DateOnBehalfOfConsideredForMembersBusinessCrossPartySupportRegisteredInterestSupportCountSupportDateIsEventLinkCurrentMinister
Question S4W-22721: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 03/10/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22591: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 24/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22592: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 24/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4O-03520: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 15/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22544: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 06/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22550: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 06/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22545: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 06/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22546: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 06/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22547: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 06/09/2014 Show Full Question >>
Question S4W-22549: Mary Scanlon, Highlands and Islands, Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party, Date Lodged: 06/09/2014 Show Full Question >>

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